That’s established and stable brands that manufacture things in China which is completely different from Chinese brands building things in China and that can just close their doors tomorrow morning and leave the owners without any source for parts.
If an established manufacturer closes their doors tomorrow morning the same issue arises, the difference is that Chinese companies are known to do that and the Chinese government sometimes is responsible for closing them or simply doesn’t care about the effect on customers. They can reopen the following day and produce the same items as before but they won’t send you parts for the thing they were producing the day prior because it’s not the same company anymore.
Well, that’s kind of what is happening today with brands started in the USA as well (Henrik Fisker pulled this stunt twice with Karma and the Fisker Automotive)
I do get your point, I just have a hard time dismissing any and all Chinese cars when the collective “we” have no issue dealing with China as long as there is some middle man charging a premium. I also have a hard time understanding how tariffs address any of these issues.
China is stable enough, or so it seems, to supply most of our electronics, electrical components, plastics, tools, mechanical parts, etc etc etc… There is certainly a way to work with them in a stable way.
Buying a Fisker has always been gamble, so is buying anything from any startup honestly… Buying a Tesla Roadster was a gamble as well!
The middlemen you’re talking about are established brands. I have no problem buying an Indian made motorcycle from KTM because I know they have a real presence in North America, a dealership network and so on, they have something to back themselves with, but I wouldn’t buy a motorcycle built in India by a brand that has no presence outside of India and that, for all I know, could just fold tomorrow leaving me with the problem of having to find parts when needed… (just using an examine with another country)
They supply most of our electronics, tools and so on, but you’ll notice that you’re not buying the Chinese brands of these things, or if you are you’re not expecting to be able to get any after sale service in 5 years…
The middlemen you’re talking about are established brands.
In this case, with the auto industry, yes you are correct. However this same exact thing happens with almost any industry.
Just a quick example, I home brew, every single device/machine/vessel I have every purchased from my “local” distributors were all made in China. All of it.
I am not saying your concerns are invalid. I am just trying to see how would it ever be different by just applying tariffs to them. Wouldn’t it make better sense to demand certain guarantees before they are allowed to sell in the USA? How would any Chinese company ever make it to the KTM status you mention?
And to clarify, I am only “defending” China here because something crazy like 90% of what we use today was made totally or partially in China, so to me it makes no sense they are only good when making money for American companies while we pay the middle man
Well the tariffs are there to protect the local industry and local jobs, without tariffs and considering the amount of subsidies and the cheap labor these companies take advantage of in China they would just flood our markets, kill the competition and then be free to do whatever they want. What Amazon did but for the car industry.
Yes, I understood… I am just making reference to my prior stance that, for the USA government at least, if Amazon does X is fine, but if a Chinese company wants to do similar, it cannot be allowed… even though, in this example, Amazon is doing the exact same bad thing with Chinese manufactured goods all the same
That’s established and stable brands that manufacture things in China which is completely different from Chinese brands building things in China and that can just close their doors tomorrow morning and leave the owners without any source for parts.
If an established manufacturer closes their doors tomorrow morning the same issue arises, the difference is that Chinese companies are known to do that and the Chinese government sometimes is responsible for closing them or simply doesn’t care about the effect on customers. They can reopen the following day and produce the same items as before but they won’t send you parts for the thing they were producing the day prior because it’s not the same company anymore.
Well, that’s kind of what is happening today with brands started in the USA as well (Henrik Fisker pulled this stunt twice with Karma and the Fisker Automotive)
I do get your point, I just have a hard time dismissing any and all Chinese cars when the collective “we” have no issue dealing with China as long as there is some middle man charging a premium. I also have a hard time understanding how tariffs address any of these issues.
China is stable enough, or so it seems, to supply most of our electronics, electrical components, plastics, tools, mechanical parts, etc etc etc… There is certainly a way to work with them in a stable way.
Buying a Fisker has always been gamble, so is buying anything from any startup honestly… Buying a Tesla Roadster was a gamble as well!
The middlemen you’re talking about are established brands. I have no problem buying an Indian made motorcycle from KTM because I know they have a real presence in North America, a dealership network and so on, they have something to back themselves with, but I wouldn’t buy a motorcycle built in India by a brand that has no presence outside of India and that, for all I know, could just fold tomorrow leaving me with the problem of having to find parts when needed… (just using an examine with another country)
They supply most of our electronics, tools and so on, but you’ll notice that you’re not buying the Chinese brands of these things, or if you are you’re not expecting to be able to get any after sale service in 5 years…
In this case, with the auto industry, yes you are correct. However this same exact thing happens with almost any industry. Just a quick example, I home brew, every single device/machine/vessel I have every purchased from my “local” distributors were all made in China. All of it.
I am not saying your concerns are invalid. I am just trying to see how would it ever be different by just applying tariffs to them. Wouldn’t it make better sense to demand certain guarantees before they are allowed to sell in the USA? How would any Chinese company ever make it to the KTM status you mention?
And to clarify, I am only “defending” China here because something crazy like 90% of what we use today was made totally or partially in China, so to me it makes no sense they are only good when making money for American companies while we pay the middle man
Well the tariffs are there to protect the local industry and local jobs, without tariffs and considering the amount of subsidies and the cheap labor these companies take advantage of in China they would just flood our markets, kill the competition and then be free to do whatever they want. What Amazon did but for the car industry.
Which again is OK when Amazon and Walmart do it based on Chinese manufactured goods but not when China does it directly? We need better than that!
Eh… I’m using Amazon as an example to show how it would be a bad thing?
Yes, I understood… I am just making reference to my prior stance that, for the USA government at least, if Amazon does X is fine, but if a Chinese company wants to do similar, it cannot be allowed… even though, in this example, Amazon is doing the exact same bad thing with Chinese manufactured goods all the same